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Postby The Archaeologist » Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:57 pm

Le Grognard wrote:(Oh, and I fully plead guilty to the passing notes thing - especially between players. :oops: )


I don't think note passing between players is such a big deal. Echaldath and Finn had a fantastic exchange all in notes, for example. The problem with note passing is when there is tons of stuff going back and forth between the GM and (a) player(s), particularly in the middle of a fight, that stops the action dead and leaves everyone else twiddling their thumbs.

But players passing notes to each other doesn't have to be disrupting.

Even passing notes to the GM sometimes has a place. We just seem to occasionally suffer from an excess of it. :P
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Postby Kabucha » Thu Nov 15, 2007 9:11 pm

I don't think note passing between players is such a big deal. Echaldath and Finn had a fantastic exchange all in notes


Again there is a time and a place for everything. Passing notes sure why not, however please don't ask a player to pass a note to another player, this is distracting to the player being asked to pass the note. Pass a note sure just pass it yourself.

There is a time not to write and pass a note, it is on your turn and passing it to the GM, waiting for the GM to reply then replying back to the GM. This in my opinion is a no no, it is very disrespectfull to the rest of the players. This can take a couple of minutes and the battle loses it momentum. Remember you are in the middle of a battle, your turn is only six seconds, not six minutes.
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Postby SQUAWK » Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:57 pm

I'm not saying that writing notes is a problem, what I think CAN cause a problem is when there is an exchange of notes between players that results in a lot of expression from the players (ie. GM's describing something or an NPC is talking to the group and two of the players are passing notes back and forth killing themselves laughing out loud or talking or making comments out loud on the notes), I think that can be very disruptive.
I think using notes to notify the GM your doing something or watching for something in particular is fine, as is talking to another player through notes...using notes for characters to have private discussions is great, as long as it doesn't start happening too much when there's action or the rest of the group is trying to interact with someone, then it starts to become an issue again.
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Postby Le Grognard » Fri Nov 16, 2007 4:52 pm

Personally, my take on notes is that notes between players is fine ... as long as it is done respecting others' attention and enjoyment of the game. So I am fine with note passing but agree that it shouldn't interfere with others acting as "carrier pigeons" or if it generates comments that detract from the group's (as a whole) focus.

Notes between players and DMs is fine ... to a point. It is fine occasionally. But I feel we do indulge WAY too much. It should only be infrequently. If you feel there is a secret that needs to be kept from your friends, then maybe your in the wrong hobby. We are all mature enough to be able to seperate what the player knows from what the character knows (or we should be) and most things contained in notes could easily be communicated with the rest of the group without impacting either the palyer's enjoyment of his character concept or the group's interaction with that PC.

It should NEVER have to occur in combat. Escpecially when the group is as large as ours is (see the other thread on Large Parties for more in this vein). The instances that I can think of it being necessary here are very very VERY few and far between.
Last edited by Le Grognard on Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Kabucha » Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:48 pm

It should NEVER have to occur in combat. Escpecially when the group is as large as ours is (see the other thread on Large Parties for more in this vein). The instances that I can think of it being necessary here are very very VERY few and far between.


Amen to that.

Out last sesion on Saturday, not one note was passed to the GM, it went very well and the pace was good.
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Postby Le Grognard » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:07 am

Kabucha wrote:Out last sesion on Saturday, not one note was passed to the GM, it went very well and the pace was good.


I agree. Yes, there was some small amount of meta-gaming talk between a few players (myself and Squawk, for instance), but it was not enough to disrupt the play or even interfere with the actual feel of the action.

A note on this: I think SOME small amount of meta-gaming talk between the players along the lines of "You do this, and I'll do that" is okay. After all, the PCs have travelled and adventured with each other for quite some time. It stands to reason that they'd sort of "know" what the other PCs would do, or be able to do, etc. The actual players don't. So the only way the can use cooperative tactics sometimes is to meta-game (or "ghost-talk" as Dawn's group used to call it).
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Postby Kabucha » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:11 pm

I think SOME small amount of meta-gaming talk between the players along the lines of "You do this, and I'll do that" is okay. After all, the PCs have travelled and adventured with each other for quite some time. It stands to reason that they'd sort of "know" what the other PCs would do, or be able to do, etc. The actual players don't. So the only way the can use cooperative tactics sometimes is to meta-game


I agree, this bodes to an adventure party who has been traveling for a while, and has gotten to know each others role in a team.
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Postby Le Grognard » Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:17 am

That's exactly what I was going for.

Now, that doesn't mean I think that a discussion on tactics should erupt every round. Nor should we discuss all the different possibilities.

But I don't think there's anything wrong with a brief two sentence discussion of what each will do. Sort of like Jackie Chan and Chris Tucker doing the "You go this way, and I'll go that way" type of thing.

Or, for those of us who can remember, the Bob Hope/Bing Crosby Road Pictures routine with "Patty Cake". :)
Last edited by Le Grognard on Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby SQUAWK » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:44 pm

And it also allows for the fact that PCs can speak to each other at any time in the round - it's an 'immediate free' action to speak so they can do so even on other players turns.
Allows for (mechanically that is) players to shout out directions to each other even in the middle of a battle to help coordinate their actions.
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Postby Kabucha » Thu Nov 22, 2007 8:35 pm

Now, that doesn't mean I think that a discussion on tactics should erupt every round. Nor should we discuss all the different possibilities.


No, that is not how I see it, it would be more like the character gesturing to each other, with hand signs, head nods and turns and so forth. Ever one is always aware if what is going on around them. People see and hears things around so in the game it would be the same.
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Postby Kabucha » Thu Nov 22, 2007 8:37 pm

Bob Hope/Bing Crosby Road Pictures routine with "Patty Cake".


LOL, yes I remember that!! Very cheeky and orginial.
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Postby Kabucha » Thu Nov 22, 2007 8:39 pm

it's an 'immediate free' action to speak so they can do so even on other players turns.


Cool, I thought we could only tak on our turn.
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Postby Le Grognard » Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:11 am

Kabucha wrote:
it's an 'immediate free' action to speak so they can do so even on other players turns.


Cool, I thought we could only tak on our turn.


It sort of depends on what you read or who you talk to. I'm fine either way... as long as it doesn't disrupt other people's turns or infringe on their playing their own character.
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Postby SQUAWK » Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:46 pm

Kabucha wrote:
it's an 'immediate free' action to speak so they can do so even on other players turns.


Cool, I thought we could only tak on our turn.


A lot depends on what you're saying - if it's a speech, or a discussion or questions etc. then yes it should probably only be your turn...if you're shouting out something to the party in the midst of combat like 'fall back' or 'regroup' then that can easily be something that can happen anytime.
As long as it doesn't interfere with others, AND the DM doesn't mind that.
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Postby Kabucha » Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:05 pm

I take it that if a players is scouting ahead, then out of game we can't tell them to look in that direction.

Talking would be like "I go this way and you go that away."

How about "Delay your turn until I can get over to heal you."

"Don't block me I'm gonna charge on my turn"
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